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campaigned for re-election on the idea of a, quote, balanced approach, end quote, to deficit reduction, a mixture of tax increases and spending cuts. here's the plan that the republicans say you presented to them. >> i can tell you what i presented. it will be helpful. >> chris: let me -- >> it is our plan, let me do it. let me explain it. >> chris: i'd like to ask you about this part of it and you can tell me. >> okay. >> chris: $1.6 trillion in tax increases. more than $80 billion in new stimulus spending, next year, and, unspecified nonguaranteed spending cuts. question, is that your idea of balance. >> it is, let me explain what is in the explain they didn't report to you and explain, to people, which is, we propose alongside the trillion dollars in spending cuts we agreed with republicans, last year, on defense and a range of other government programs, proposed $600 billion of detailed reforms and savings, to our health care and other government programs, that is $600 billion. in fact, the health care savings in that plan, are larger than the plans we have seen republicans in the
in the top, those two things can be done at the same time. it's not very good for the long-term deficit. but as i always say, no one actually cares about the deficit. >> right. the -- there's a report out tonight that tim geithner made a fascinating proposal to boehner today which is basically get congress out of the debt ceiling game. mr. geithner proposed permanently ending congressional purview over the federal borrowing limit. republican aides revealed this. he said that congress could be allowed to pass a resolution blocking an increase in the debt limit, but that the president would be able to veto that resolution, and so then only a two-thirds -- two-thirds of lawmakers would be necessary to override a veto. put it -- put basically the debt ceiling into presidential veto land, as a spot where they would have influence. they will not go along with this. it is a brilliant and correct idea. >> it's a brilliant idea. and i think the fact that we're actually hearing democrats talk about the 14th amendment solution, saying the debt limit is unconstitutional in and maybe we'll go there
the deficit we have. the truth is, if you want to balance the budget, which i do, you have to have increased revenues and you have significant spending cuts. and you have said many times on this program that raising taxes on rich people is not enough to deal with the deficit. you are right. the truth is, the best thing we could do is go over the fiscal cliff. we have the same tax rates that we have when bill clinton was president. significant cuts in defense and also significant human services can you tell us. >> katie, let me ask you, before you respond to what governor dean is saying. there is logic to what howard dean is saying. i don't happen to agree with it. but i know where he's coming from. katie, let me ask you this -- katie can't hear me. we'll wait for her to get back hooked in. howard, what about the notion that i'm posing tonight -- i've said this a few times -- republicans better be careful. they're not going down your road and the democrats aren't going down your road. you have middle class tax cuts for the democrats and it sometimes sounds to me as an old reagan conservative
different economy. what we have now is 8% unemployment. very sluggish growth and a trillion dollar deficit every year. you propose to raise taxes in that environment and you're not going to get growth. >> don't you understand you need to off set-- if you're serious about debt reduction, i think you are, don't you understand you need revenue and spending cuts. stuart: and how do you get revenues. >> how. >> please, go ahead, go ahead. stuart: it's easy you lower tax rates and keep incentive to work harder. >> we've tried that. stuart: and you can't-- what. >> george bush tried that. look at the deficit we had. stuart: well, wait a minute you cannot rewrite economic history. after george bush lowered tax rates the return to the treasury, the money coming into the treasury went way up and the deficit, by the way, in 2007 was 167 billion dollars. >> so. stuart: president obama has got, 167 billion a month just about. don't rewrite economic history, julie. >> i'm not rewriting economic history. stuart: you are. >> i'm not-- >> i'm telling you if you lower tax rates you'll get more revenue. >> t
of 2013-type solution. but the reality of dealing with this economy, its debt, it's deficit, spending priorities and all of that is not going to get done in the next five weeks. so let's be honest about that. i agree with you. i think that they're going to come to a short-term stopgap solution that deals with the cliff, that deals with the bush tax cuts that expire, that deal with the increase in unemployment rate that's due to hit in january. they'll deal with those short-term things, but the long-term systemic substantive points that need to be addressed will not get addressed in the next four weeks. >> steve, how would you markets respond if they decide we'll have a short-term fix but we haven't actually managed to come up with the real healthy response to what the economy needs? >> you're seeing a total kick the can. we really got nothing done this december, tough luck, we just want to extend it six months, i think the markets would be jittery but would probably accept it. going over the cliff -- and we were talking about this the other night in washington with a bunch of ceos," g
accomplish something. if you go back to before bush tax cuts, three quarters of the deficit is gone. it was supposed to sunset two years ago. when is a good time to let those things sunset? >> you're right, there's never a good time. >> maybe do something with the sequester, but let the tax cuts expire. >> although i have to say at this time it's too much i think in terms of the tax increase. >> we never want any pain. >> you're right. and we do need to get our fiscal house in order. but again, this is why the idea would be to come up with a longer term plan where you could scale some of these things in and you have to come up with a plan that you'll stick to, otherwise you get into this where -- >> we never stick to anything. if we get another deal that is toothless and -- >> the markets will become even more skeptical because we've seen this before. but i have to say two things. i don't necessarily buy into the deal that there's a fiscal slope. i have to say on the tax side, one of the things we keep talking about is the amt. boy, that's something that will -- >> howard goes on an
discussed for more than a year and a half on the campaign trail, $4 trillion of balanced deficit reduction. weight not a real proposal what is john boehner sent to the white house which actually lowered rates for those at the top but asked the middle class to bear the entire burden of deficit reduction. that's not what the american people voted for. i mean if you look at even cnn's exit polls all over this country, upwards of 60, 65% of people voted for balanced deficit reduction, which means asking those at the top to pay their fair share. more people voted for that, the idea of that, then they voted for the president. so we need to look to the american people and look what they want on how to reduce the deficit. we have to do it in a balanced way and fair way. >> but if you look at polling and i know you don't always just go on polling, right, but polling is also -- you ask people what should be cut, 79% say don't cut medicare at all and i think that lots of things, democrats and republicans have said, that is on the table too. you don't always necessarily follow the polls when you liste
of a process to reduce the deficit the others face. >> republicans don't like owning reform either. this was tom cole on sunday. >> only obama can fix entitlements. democrat versus democrat fight over entitlement which mirrors their fighting over taxes. a response to an argument that was starting before former adviser steve ratner and minnesota democratic congressman keith ellison with near glee. there is no real choice about that. we're clear social security is off the table. this is, to me, the much more interesting debate between tom and dan. >> you want republicans arguing. both sides are also battling for control of the debt ceiling which may represent the republicans' greatest point of leverage in these budget talks. goo the speaker of the house says that's a nonstarter. >> silliness. congress will never give up the power. i've made it clear to the president. we need cuts in reform greater than the increase in the debt limit. >> bottom line, you've got to put a detailed plan on the table that the white house ends up agreeing to some of it, rejects some of it in the same way t
income tax cuts. the republicans say the plan cuts the deficits by $4.6 trillion based on the white house method of counting based on the recommendations of the president's deficit reduction commission but the president could disagree. the republicans say the plan would raise $800 million through tax reform but not by phasing out the upper income bush tax cuts and before the plan was announced, white house press secretary insisted the rates will not make it to the new year. >> he will not sign a bill that extends those tax rates for the top 2 percent. we cannot afford it. it is not wise economic policy. not wise fiscal policy. it would defeat the principle of balance that he has embraced. >> the president wrapped up an hour long twitter session promoting what he called a balanced approach, as far as deficit reduction. >>shepard: is this posturing? >>reporter: well, it is, this great measure. each side wants to blame the other. and not just if we go over the cliff, but if they do reach an agreement, each side wants the other to take the blame for the parts of the ultimate compromise their
overwhelming the deficit story was at that point. you know, you look at that administration. the coming in, just no one thought they could do anything. it's not unlike the conversations we're having now. and they went in, they did the deal, president bush had to shift from read my lips to as only he could put it, read my hips. and it was good for the country, it created a political dynamic that cost president bush the election in 1992, and which we're still living, because that gave us grover norquist, et cetera. >> let's get to grover norquist in a minute, but i do have a question. the gop plan consists of $2.2 trillion in savings over a decade. that includes raging the eligibility age for medicare from 65 to 67. and lowering cost of living increases for social security benefits. they also propose overhauling the tax code to generate $800 billion in new revenue. but without raising taxes on the wealthy. in a letter to the president, leading republicans compared their plan to one erskine bowles drew up last year. >> not even close. >> he rejected that connection and the white house, of cou
, congress realized that if they couldn't compromise on a deficit and revenue plan, our economy would crash. turns out they couldn't compromise. so here's what they did. in order to force themselves to work together and compromise, they concocted a catastrophic penalty that would itself crash our economy. brilliant. put it another way. if there is an asteroid headed towards the earth, we made it and fired it at ourselves. because otherwise we would never have done the hard work required to protect ourselves from asteroids. >> good morning. it's friday, november 30th. welcome to "morning joe." with us on set, we have msnbc political analyst and vice president and executive editor of msnbc.com, richard wolffe is here. >> he's here? >> my lord. right here on the set. political editor and white house correspondent for the huffington post, sam stein. >> hi. >> cute thing. and msnbc political analyst and visiting professor at nyu and former democratic congressman harold ford jr. >> good morning. >> good morning. >> he's reading. >> put that down right now. put the smut down. close it up. >> i'm l
that if we go over the cliff the deficit goes up. >> and the debt goes up. >> and the debt goes up. >> wrong. >> like our relationship people don't get it. >> deficit almost goes away. difference is about $8 trillion. >> about 10.5. >> join us tomorrow. right now it's time for "squawk on the street." >>> good wednesday morning. welcome to "squawk on the street." live at the nyse. what a morning shaping up here. a little data to look at. m&a. the president speaks to the business roundtable in a couple of hours. futures with modest gains. europe holding onto gains and china up nearly 3% over night as shanghai catches a break. our road map begins with a $20 billion deal. freeport mcmoran getting into the energy business making two acquisitions. plains exploration and mcmoran exploration. >>> concerns over the u.s. economy as adp misses estimates. the blame goes to superstorm sandy. goldman says the party is officially over for gold. >> starbucks at an investors conference will add 1,500 stores in the u.s. over the next five years. wait until you hear what they said about china. >> a big day in
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and its deficit. that's what we need. to try to slam the brakes right now and get to balance tomorrow is not desirable. economists will come on your show and tell you that that would not be good for the economy. so i think we're dealing with a degree of artificiality right there. >> congressman keith ellison, thanks for joining us. >> any time. thank you. >>> for more on this, let's bring in our cnn political contributor and republican strategist, mary matalin and cornel belcher, democratic strategist and pollster with the obama 2012 campaign. mary, what do you make of the details of this opening bid from the white house? republicans have already dismissed it but does it give us any clues at all about what an eventual deal might look like? >> it's reported that mitch mcconnell, senate minority leader, burst out laughing when he heard it. it's not even worthy of a laugh. it's really sad, it's pathetic. we went from a reasonable theoretical $3 in cuts for $1 in revenue which was basically the simpson-bowles, and are now at $4 of real and immediate tax increases plus new spending for in
to work, a lot of the deficit goes away. >> didn't they say that last time? >> i didn't vote for that and the word stimulus is totally discredited. it did not -- 7% of that bill was investment and infrastructure. 42% was tax cuts. we've been trying tax cuts for more than a decade. they don't put people back to work. real investment does. we have report after report, economist after economist, real investment will put millions of people back to work. >> right. those were tax cuts of the vast middle in this country. what you want to extend and the republicans. i'm still confused. if the president wants $1.6 trillion in revenue and is going to do his math, that's $3 trillion in cuts. why only put 400 billion out? >> well, he's probably leaving himself a little room to negotiate. >> a little. >> is reasonable on medicare. if he just started negotiating lower drug prices, that saves medicare $230 billion over ten years. and then you deal with some of these high cost private insurance plans under medicare and a couple of other minor changes that won't hurt average american, won't m
. >> absolutely. >> and that is increasing and guess what, that adds up to the deficit, right? >> david, the problem is deeper than what you are describing. this goes back decades. when you look at entitlement spending over the last half century, it has steadily crept up four percent every year and that includes adjustments for population growth. so what then? you increase taxes four percent every year? that is absurd. at some point we need both parties to come together and tax this entitlement creep. we mention obama ape lot. he hasn't helped the numbers. but when you look at enment spending it goes up under a republican president. he can go in this and blame the republicans. >> i didn't know there was a entitlement creep. maybe i got you wrong. >> it is it an itch. >> and john, what about this. we have a budget if you can call it a budget that includes tax increases and no cuts at all from our treasury security. >> the tax increase aspect is ridickulous. we have a spending problem . you look at entitlements. i think it is i i don't they should exist. we did make promises and so the id
achieved, but not meaningful debt or deficit reduction, no reform to entitlements, and i don't think there's tax reform. there's a deal in form, but i think there's more to get done. >> are we done? >> ask another if you want. >> do they really have to raise taxes? people accepted that's the outcome. >> i think that they need to raise revenue. how they do it, whether it's some tax increases or some limiting of deductions, but it shouldn't be hard to bridge a gap that's wider and wider. >> a matter of what it looks like, a given at this point. >> i think it is. >> higher taxes are coming. doug, thank you. ask as many questions as you want. >> you're generous with your time. >> that's what dagen does when she's here. >> she would be huck -- heckling you for your bad voice today. the supposed middleman in the debt negotiations throwing fire on the talks this week by saying nothing will get done unless republicans agree to raise tax rates on the rich. >> there you go. rich edson in dc with the latest on that. hey, rich. >> congressional republicans say the latest fiscal cliff shrugged off the
for four years, i left unemployment high, i increased the size of the debt and the deficit, i got everything i wanted, the place is a mess and look, i got reelected. so, what's so hard about me continuing to doing that and blaming it on them. obviously, i'm very good at that and that's base clr where he's going here and the republicans i think are not very good poker players, they're signaled they're relucks tennant to go over the cliff. if you're in this showdown, i is a, come on, bring it. >> paul: they will get blamed if that happens and the president is signaling that. that wouldn't be a pleasant outcome for them. you're saying they should suggest to the president we had he' be willing to do that and maybe he'll give at the end? >> yeah, i think they have to show that they are it, that he's in a negotiation and that he has to give and that they're willing to give and if they just say, look, we're so afraid of getting blamed for that, of course, he's going to roll over them. >> kim, where do you think the republicans are? where should they go here? do they have real options, an
schools, and i want to do all this while bringing down our deficits in a balanced and responsible way. now -- [ applause ] >> on this last point we probably heard a lot of talk in washington and in the media about the deadlines that we're facing on jobs and taxes and investment. this is not some run of the mill debate. this isn't about which political party can come out on top in negotiations. we've got important decisions to make, and they'll have a real impact on businesses and families all across the country. our ultimate goal, our long-term goal is to get our long-term deficit under control in a way that is balanced and is fair. that would be good for businesses, for our economy, for future generations. i believe both parties can and will work together in the coming weeks to get that done. we know how that gets done. we're iffing to have to raise a little more revenue. we got to cut on the spending we don't need, building on the trillion dollars of spending cuts we've already made, and if we combine those two things, we can create a path where america is paying its bills while still be
because we thought the budget was going to be -- the deficit was going to be about $150 billion. that shocked everyone into action. then, unlike now, there remains some degree of bipartisanship. there was comity, there was discussion, even as we battled over the budget, we worked together in a bipartisan way on many other issues. you didn't have the total polarization that you have today. >> i mean, when you were elected senate majority leader, i understand one of the first people that you called was the minority leader, senator dole. >> that's right. i called him right away, i went to see him almost immediately, and i said to him look, you've been here a long time, i'm relatively new, these are very tough jobs in the best of circumstances, and if we don't have some degree of trust between us, they will be impossible jobs. so i said to him i want to tell you how i intend to behave toward you and to ask that you behave towards me in the same way. and we agreed on the most basic of things. i told him i would not surprise him, that's important in the senate. that he would always ha
be called upon to do a little more in terms of helping to pay down our deficit and debt. i think the electorate answers that question so that's got to play a role in the negotiation and has. but i think we'll get to yes. >> how are you going to do it though? you said you know you're going to have to compromise. what areas in entitlements, for instance, or other areas do you think there is a willingness to compromise to get us closer to resolving the fiscal cliff issue? >> i think democrats have already shown a willingness to make very significant cuts. we've already in the budget control act agreed to an excess of $1 trillion of cuts. that's a pretty good faith counsel payment on our willingness to come to the table and do things that are very painful and difficult for us to do. we haven't seen that yet reciprocated in terms of gop willingness to raise the kind of revenues that we've already committed to reducing in terms of spending cuts. but i think we've demonstrated very good faith that we're ready to make the hard calls to pay down our debt, balance our books. at the same ti
. and a $500 billion down payment on the deficit and the debt, i think, is actually a nice piece of certainty for business so that they can plan for 2013 and 2014. it will mean an exceedingly weak first quarter next year, but i think throughout the year economic growth will get stronger. david: well, but, michael, on the other hand, sometimes if i'm certain somebody's dead, that won't bring them back to life. sometimes certainty is not necessarily good news. you say that the market is rather than on the negative side rather than on the positive side, and if we do go over the fiscal cliff, you see possibility of negative figures as low as 4%, right? >> well, let's put all this in perspective. i think what i mentioned earlier was the fact that the s&p is up about 6% since november 16th, and we've run into technical resistance with some the previous people mentioned, and i think the market's just in a period now where it could easily pull back a little bit. if you listen to the rhetoric coming out of washington, we had the everybody gave your hugs after the election, now they're throwing out the
agreed we should have a balanced approach to deficit reduction that doesn't hurt the economy and doesn't hurt middle class families. if both parties agree we should not raise taxes on middle class families let's begin our work with where we agree. >> americans are concerned. but divided over the best solution to avoid the fiscal cliff. take a look at an abc news washington post poll that shows 60% of americans support upper income americans having their taxes raised. 37% oppose it. on issue of reducing deductions, 44% support that. 49% oppose it. much like lawmakers they realize there is a big problem that needs to be fixed but divided on how to fix it. >> in addition to the goings on in the capitol there is a big lunch at the white house today. governor romney coming by for a bite to eat. a lot of speculation about what might be discussed at the meal and the possibility of maybe future job? >> jay carney pushed back on that yesterday. the president said there was no suggestion here that he had a special assignment for him. the president invited mitt romney to come to the white house b
if things start to change and in fact, the underlying real problem, the growing deficit on the path to greece, the goal gets worse once we kick the can away. that will be the overriding probleming not the slowing economy not people spending money, but sure, that might not happen in the first two months, but it will eventually happen if we keep kicking down the can. we want to prove to the world that we have a solution and if it takes a few months to get there and higher taxes for a while, big deal, we will get there. that's got to be the plan not just the same nonsense. >> yeah, but larry, that's part of your point, but jonas says we're not in a bad recession, we're certainly not in a good recovery. and if we just keep falling little bit by little bit, maybe as much as jump off the cliff, but it's certainly a slippery slope. >> brenda, the damage is already being done. we saw it in november retail sales and companies delaying activity already and we know the ratings agencies are minutes away, we're right to fix the problem in the long run than making a bandaid short-term deal. it do
to deficit reduction that can help give businesses certainty and make sure the country grows. and unfortunately the speaker's proposal right now is still out of balance. he talks, for example, about $800 billion worth of revenues, but he says he's going to do that by lowering rates. when you look at math, it doesn't work. >> reporter: so unbalanced approach is the white house's nice way of saying you got to be kidding me. jay carney used the phrase in the briefing just now that the proposal from the republicans was a bunch of magic needs and fairy dust and the current standoff is continuing with neither side talking today, brooke. >> magic beans, fairy dust, la la land, it is laughable but not. it is serious stuff that affects every one of us come january 1st, 28 days to go. we know some of the reporting from dana bash on the hill, there are no formal talks going on. the president insists in speaking in this bloomberg interview, he does speak to speaker boehner all the time that the meetings are not what matter. what have you, jessica yellin what have you learned in your repo
is a deficit hawk. liberal, but he is a deficit hawk. he doesn't say maybe if we can't get a deal together, maybe we'd be okay with the fiscal cliff. he says that is the best deal for everyone, the best deal for progressives, just to do it. to go back to the clinton era rates. you get rid of three quarters of the deficit just on tax increases at that point. >> and he says you get defense cuts. >> you can't get defense cuts any other way. and he's not the only one. there's a lot of people on the left and there's quite a few people on the right. i'm glad you're optimistic and a lot of ceos and guys in your position -- if you run a company, you don't need consumers petrified and business people petrified. this is the last thing we need if you run a company. i understand you have a horse in the game. >> but you also have the double trigger. if you go over the cliff, we've got the debt ceiling fight right afterwards. it's not like that's six months down the line. that's in if first month, six weeks of the new year. >> the other thing, depending on where you stand, the idea that we just get rid
the business community views this deficit thing as the biggest problem that we can solve that we need to solve. there's something called a campaign to fix the debt, which i'm on the steering committee, 120 leading ceos from everything from general electric to jpmorgan on down. really committed to doing something and accepting the idea that revenues have to go up, not ideological about how, but most of all, wanting a big $4 trillion package. and so they have become, in effect, allies of the president. they're really trying to get to the same place. at some point there may be differences over how much entitlements, how much this or that, but right now their interests are aligned, and they both agreed to be friends again. and so they've spent a stream of business ceos into the white house. the president -- yesterday the business roundtable and gave a very warm and accommodating speech. and they are comrades in arms, the least for the time being. >> willie, what a big difference from what we heard from business leaders for the first four years. this is a pretty dramatic shift. >> or even just a fe
debt and deficits a lot smaller by comparison because you get more government revenue. you're right, it is absolutely a core principle of republicans we don't want taxes to go up to get more government. if we have tax reform effort that will lower the tax base, get more revenue and fuel economic growth that is something republicans will embrace. there could be revenue generated by closure of loopholes and deductions. we can't accomplish anything by raising tax that is good good for the economy and we're very concerned about the economy. martha: it will be interesting to see what timothy geithner brings to these discussions today. we'll be reporting on it and you will be there on the hill. thank you very much. >> we'll look forward to it. thanks, martha. martha: all right. bill: there is a controversial vote set to take place today at the united nations and the u.s. is expected to vote against it. eric shawn's live at the u.n. eric, good morning to you, what is the vote about first of all and what's expected to happen? >> reporter: good morning, bill. the vote on the palestinians, a
not represent the bowles simpson plan, nor is it the bowles plan in my testimony on deficit reduction. i simply took the mid point of the public offers, put forward during the negotiations to demonstrate where i thought a deal could be reached at the time. he's very much backing away from speaker boehner's letter. the question i wanted to ask you is some of the details, as you know, it's all in. >> can we spin one more point on that? >> absolutely. >> here's speaker boehner who is taking a mid point on the compromise between the two sides and offered it, and it's already flatley rejected? >> i think he may be rejected, sir, if i may -- >> i'm not talking about simpson -- erskine boelsz. i'm talking about the white house's response to it. >> let's get to that too. i think what erskine bowles is saying in his statement, that this letter from speaker boehner does not represent his theory, number one, but i think the line that the white house is having problems with, and i believe i found it in page two of the speaker's letter, i'll read it to you if i can. he says this, notably, the new revenue in
to the entitlement reform portion of this deficit reduction plan. that's politically very tricky, as you know, because a lot of times dealing with entitlements will be construed as cuts to medicare and that's often not very popular. as you can imagine that deal that you just outlined, not received very well by republicans on the hill. >> i think we're going over the cliff. it's pretty clear to me they've made a political calculation. this offer doesn't remotely deal with entitlement reform in a way to save medicare and medicaid, and social security from imminent bankruptcy. the president's plan when it comes to entitlement reform is just quite frankly a joke so i don't think they're serious about finding a deal. >> so not really good language you're hearing soledad. house speaker john boehner said he found the proposal flabbergasting. he said it's not serious. but you definitely have the white house here and democrats feeling that they have some leverage. they look at polls that show americans are more prepared to blame republicans because of the impasse and also the fact that the consequence
in these negotiations or in terms of reducing this $1.1 trillion deficit if you don't do something about these entitlements. so everyone's kind of waiting, when will the president come forward with those? >> if i could just jump in really quick, one of the problems with entitlement cuts is they don't produce a lot of savings in the first ten years. so, if we're going to be obsessively folked on the ratio between revenue and spending, then republicans are going to be in for some disappointment because all the things they want on entitlements basically phase in. this is consistent what they said about not wanting to change things for people over 55. and the fact that even paul ryan and mitt romney ran away from entitlement cuts in paul ryan's budget in the last election i think is a sign of where the american public is. they want the rich to pay their fair share in taxes, but they really don't like a lot of cuts. >> to some extent. >> and erin, look, in response to what you were just saying about the fact these savings don't really kick in for ten years, that is a legitimate point. look wh
, and of course hopefully reduce the deficit as well. very busy day there at the white house. on thursday, we have all our eyes on washington. two controversial changes in washington state, same-sex marriage becomes legal on thursday in washington state. we'll also be looking at marijuana. adults over 21 can legally carry up to an ounce of pot, sort of. the federal government still says pot is an illegal drug. that's how they're going to do it in washington on thursday. and on friday, we'll be watching for the jobs report. this is the november jobs report. in october, 171,000 jobs were add a added, you may recall. experts think superstorm sandy could affect this. a lot of people having a hard time getting around, power is out. really put a lot of folks behind. we'll see how that goes. on saturday, a big day for college football fans. heisman trophy winner will be announced. we'll find out who the best player in college football is. last year, can you remember who it is? nfl star robert griffin iii won the heisman. that's your week ahead. >>> well, his name was jordan davis, a 17-year-old boy who w
to be handed down the $60 trillion defic deficit. they will come to a deal. but right now, it's political theater. and it's probably going to look like the simpson-bowles. that will come full-circle again. >> here's a problem the republicans have got themselves into. is obama has been very clever here, the president. i think what he's done is skillfully said to the public, if he goes over the fiscal cliff, the republicans are prepared to make the entire middle class to pay more tax to save 2% of the wealthiest americans paying a little bit more. and that's a very bad position for the republicans to find themselves in, isn't it? >> it certainly is. it's a very bad position for them to find themselves in. the fact of the matter, it isn't true. raising taxes on the wealthiest americans will not only solve the problems. it doesn't even address the core problems. the core problems, $16 trillion in national debt comes from government overspending. and we have sluggish growth. raising the taxes on anybody, whether it's the poor or the middle class or the wealthiest americans, doesn't solve that
rates, total money that that comes in is just a small drop in the bucket so the size of the deficit from last year alone. it's less than 10% of what we're overspending. we now have 16 trillion in debt on the backs of our children and grand children. that is the biggest threat to our national security and nation's future. >> quickly, some republicans have whispered privately, some not privately, they believe president obama, the white house, congressional democrats, want to go over the fiscal cliff because they believe that it is more politically advantageous for them to do so. is that a sentiment you agree with or not? >> i believe that the president and the democrats see a political victory at the bottom of the fiscal cliff. i see financial problems for our country at the bottom of the fiscal cliff with unemployment over 9%, and another recession. i think -- i want to find a solution working with people on both sides of the aisle but when you have howard dean, the former chairman of the democratic national committee, you have patty murray, who ran the democratic senatorial committee enc
. and that is, we must ask the wealthy to pay a little more so we can get these deficit eliminated. get our debt paid down and start growing the economy again. that's not unusual or new to any of us. nobody in the country. so i think the president is sticking to what he said throughout the campaign and as i said 3 million more people voted for him than voted for the other guy. >> with that said, on taxes, if there's any chance on your side, is there any chance on your side to come down to the form of a smaller tax hike on incomes above $250,000 or would you consider keeping rate it is same at $250,000 and raising them only on higher incomes, say half a million or $1 million a year? >> i think it's all part of the negotiations. we know where the president is and that is 250,000. but there are a lot of democrats who voiced back before the campaign 500,000, some say even a million. all of that is going to be negotiated. the president wants 250. if mr. boehner wants to come and offer something different, i'm sure he will do that. but the president stands at 250. which is below even where i was but h
to pay for 8 days of running the federal government. that still leaves a trillion dollars deficit. get serious. former ways and means committee chairman congressman bill archer joins us tonight at 7:00 eastern. stuart: well, the tax on dividends is going to go up next year. maybe by 3.8%. maybe by a whole lot more. depending on the fiscal cliff. larry ellison, top guy at oracle, he had an early dividend payout. he got a check for almost 200 million dollars. he saves 56 million by not getting that money next year. liz? liz: yeah, this is true for a lot of companies. it's the insiders who own stock in the companies that are making these moves. the so-called 1%. you know it is within their rights to do it. but what bothers me are those who say we must pay our fair share, the executives who are for, you know, raising taxes, that we have to sacrifice, and then they are avoiding higher taxes in obama care, as you point out over the break, nothing to do with the fiscal cliff, it is with health reform that they are avoiding. david: and these are the same people, the people who say we should pa
republicans are still in disagreement over how to reduce the deficit and avoid a raft of tax hikes and spending cuts. yesterday our own jim cramer and maria bartiromo were on "meet the press" and cramer had a message for fellow panelists and father of the anti-tax pledge, grover norquist. >> most ceos are republican. they're on board. they're not on board with you. they're not on board with you because they fear your view. they think you do not favor going -- you favor going over the cliff. that's what they think. they think that you favor -- >> just for the record since we're on tv. that's silly if they think that they shouldn't be ceos. >> it doesn't really matter. that's what they think. >> i want you to walk me up to that moment. >> behind the record. i like that too. >> i'm stuck. like grover is stuck with this pledge he made everybody take which is that they have to go over the cliff because they obviously will not ever say the word tax. they will only say revenue. i'm stuck speaking to many more ceos than grover norquist is. he thinks it's silly. he thinks ceos are silly. i
that actually reduces our deficit. i'm willing to work with anyone to put a plan on the table, but we're not willing to negotiate with someone who hasn't put a plan on the table. the president has not put a serious plan on the table. >> as far as a compromise on the marginal tax rate 35% going up let's say 36% or 37%, is that acceptable? >> no. no. because marginal tax rate increases if there is any increase in revenue, just gives them more to play with on capitol hill and more to spend. when we talk about fairness, when the top 2%, the $250,000 and above are already paying 45% of total income tax, that's a big question of fairness there too. >> who should nicki haley name to replace you? >> i talk today her today. i share the same philosophy, the conservative philosophy. i told her i trust her decision and i'm not going to push her one way or another. >> a lot of speculation, congressman scott? >> he's a wonderful person. our whole delegation is really strong. she's got a tough choice, but i'm convinced she'll give me someone as good or better than i am i can pass the torch to. and i
was on this morning, whom i have great respect for, he had the piece from the imf study when you cut the deficit by 1%, what is the impact on the gdp. they didn't get into that this morning but if his numbers he's using 0.9 to 1.4, if you lose 2% to 3% of gdp you'll go to negative growth which will impact -- >> at the very least the wheels will be on the runway. >> absolutely. >> let's switch gears, mario draghi today, listen, i was so wrong and i don't know how long it will last but i give him credit, at least for this period of time, how long it lasts because there is no growth and recession in europe i can't answer but what were your observations on that press conference? >> last night when i wrote about it, mario draghi can put his feet up and have a stella and enjoy. he bought himself time. july 6th will be mario draghi's day of celebration because he stemmed the financial crisis in europe and bought time. berlusconi comes onto the scene this morning with the politics and italian debt markets paid a price for it, it's coming back as we're talking, rallied back quite a bit in the ten-year bond fu
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